Feminism, Relationships, and Sociopathy

Once again Natalia Antonova provides a useful insight into the mindset of modern feminists:

The context is fidelity in marriage:

First let’s just address the point that Antonova’s writings are those of someone stuck in permanent, angry adolescence yet she’s telling others to grow up. And the therapy remark? Well, yeah.

But let’s look at her main point: in a marriage, “nobody owes anyone shit”. So presumably this:

“From this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, to love and to cherish, till death do us part, according to God’s holy ordinance; and thereto I pledge myself to you.”

is just a load of guff they say to keep the wedding guests amused. Note that both the bride and groom say these words, not just the bride, but that doesn’t stop feminists deriding marriage as a one-sided affair in which the man takes ownership of the woman.

But this doesn’t necessarily have to be about marriage. Any relationship is based on trust, mutual respect, and compromise and within a short time each party owes the other something. Perhaps not in a court of law, but society is governed by its own set of rules and relationships are by definition a series of mutual obligations. If I get drunk and make a fool of myself at a friend’s party, I owe the affected people an apology the next day. If a friend or partner needs my help with something, I am committed to do so regardless of inconvenience to me (within reason). If it’s someone as close as your wife or husband, you are obliged to make all manner of difficult compromises and put yourself to considerable inconvenience for the sake of the other person. That’s the entire point, is it not?

However, this seems to get missed more and more in the modern age. Last year I said in the context of a couple splitting up:

The modern advice is ignore, ignore, ignore – as if the whole thing happened in isolation. I suppose it depends on who you are, but I’m the sort of guy who thinks a woman who you’ve been in a relationship with deserves a period after the breakup of being pissed off, and she has a right to communicate with you.

Modern men and women want to enter into something as complicated as a relationship but expect to be able to exit at the push of a button as if it never happened. I’ve seen women declaring love and talking earnestly with a man about long-term plans and then a few days later end the relationship by phone and block all communication saying “it’s best we both move on”, like some toad of a politician who’s been caught breaking the law. Men do the same thing, and it puts a serious question mark over anything which happened prior to that: if you’re prepared to pull the plug and run away like that, it was probably never serious in the first place – and he or she is certainly not ready for the give-and-take of a proper relationship.

Recently I read these words on the Facebook page of a New York feminist, again in the context of a couple who had split up and the man wasn’t being sufficiently mute about it:

We owe you nothing. Not our bodies, or our time, or looking a certain way, acting a certain way, or even an explanation or response.

Got that, everyone? When we enter into a relationship with you, we don’t even have to give you our time, and we can walk away whenever we like without even a response or explanation. And we can behave however we please, as well. This is bad enough in itself, but the mindset leads to women initiating divorce for the most petty of reasons, knowing the law will allow them to take the house and the bulk of her husband’s wealth along with their children. If someone were to make a list of the ideologies which are causing the greatest damage to western society, modern feminism would be very near the top. This is why I rail against it so much on this blog.

The idea that you owe nobody anything in a relationship goes beyond amoral into outright sociopathy. Thanks to Antonova’s habit of airing her personal laundry all over Twitter, we know she was in an abusive marriage and is now divorced. I do not condone marital abuse of any kind, but I will say that if you enter into a relationship with the attitude that “nobody owes anyone shit” things are unlikely to go very well thereafter. It’s why I said the other day that knowing a person’s past is absolutely essential when beginning a new relationship: you have no idea what you may be getting into. There are some serious sociopaths out there, and while many do, not all of them advertise it.

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24 thoughts on “Feminism, Relationships, and Sociopathy

  1. >If I get drunk and make a fool of myself at a friend’s party, I owe the effected people an apology the next day.

    I remember the days when if you didn’t get drunk and make a fool of yourself at a friend’s party, you’d owe him an apology the next day.

  2. Your sub-editor is usually excellent. Are they having a duvet day?

    Isn’t it my readers’ job, and delight, to point out all errors in my work? Get cracking, lad!

  3. If you insist: “effected” should be “affected”.

    Ah yeah, thanks.

  4. ” Thanks to Antonova’s habit of airing her personal laundry all over Twitter, we know she was in an abusive marriage …”
    Well, we know she claims she was the victim of an abusive relationship. But, like the woman in a previous thread who was claiming a violent rape to validate her opinions, the correct response is “Can you stand that up, petal? You have the court transcripts? The trial verdict?”
    That many women have only the loosest relationship with the reality shared by the rest of us & owe no obligations to truth is a given.

  5. But, like the woman in a previous thread

    Same one. But yes, I’ve taken her claims at face value.

  6. If no-one owes anyone anything in a relationship, then our lady can’t complain about her man being abusive. If women don’t owe civilised behaviour, then men don’t either.

    It’s a stupid, self-defeating way of thinking.

    I suspect what she’s actually wanting is to be a princess. Men have to be gentlemen, but she doesn’t have to be a lady.

  7. That’s the great lie isn’t it.

    Marriage is absolutely about women taking ownership of blokes. We sign up to it for the sake of a quiet life but it’s more expensive and less pleasurable than a cocaine habit…

  8. Perhaps not in a court of law…

    Oddly enough, the financial support bit is enforceable in a court of law, the sammich making, not so much.

    I’ve seen women declaring love and talking earnestly with a man about long-term plans

    Women use language to manipulate, not communicate. No warranty, expressed or implied, etc.

  9. There are some serious sociopaths out there, and while many do, not all of them advertise it.

    Their Twitter account is always a good place to start.

  10. I agree when you are in a relationship there are unwritten rules that you should follow.

    However once it is over, usually after a very traumatic period of struggling to fix it, then you don’t owe them anything unless there are kids. They may feel pissed, so do you, but they don’t have any rights to take it out on you because they want to get closure their way and use you as a punch bag. Let them sort it out themselves, you have to.

  11. knowing a person’s past is absolutely essential when beginning a new relationship: you have no idea what you may be getting into

    Although with Antonova, I reckon five minutes in her company would give you a suitable heads-up.

    You’d have to be pretty desperate to let it go past the first drink.

  12. I see this as a result of the participation trophy, mulligan no-fault-I-get-a-do-over culture.

    With those wedding vows you are declaring your promise of everything to the other, until death. Not until you don’t feel like it anymore. It’s work. And it takes a few years for that to sink in fully and practice it.

    God help the woman that is such a sociopath that she doesn’t feel she owes anything. They should never take that vow then. But here’s what’s funny – it is the nexus of the wall cycle.

    A single woman with that attitude is doomed. This is where the “where are all the good guys” and “I’m celebrating my (alone) freedom” and of course the ubiquitous backpacker chick articles come from. Hamstering that they are somehow normal, and didn’t blow it before they became less attractive to men. Physical beauty is only half the equation. Inner beauty is the other half.

    It’ll be interesting to see them at 50-60 and the articles about how to build a support system way late in life. One that most wives and mothers have earned from decades of marriage and kids.

  13. If no-one owes anyone anything in a relationship, then our lady can’t complain about her man being abusive.

    What makes her situation interesting is she surrounds herself online by white-knighting beta boys, who once took exception to me. Every time she airs her dirty laundry, a phalanx of them step forward with saccharine-laced platitudes. Yet who sired her brat, thus passing on his genes? Yes, the alpha thug who beat her six ways from Sunday. None of this would surprise anyone who’s read Chateau Heartiste.

  14. However once it is over, usually after a very traumatic period of struggling to fix it, then you don’t owe them anything unless there are kids.

    That’s true, and every situation is different, but the struggling to fix it is a big part of fulfilling your obligations.

  15. “Nobody owes anyone shit”

    That should be quoted back at her every time she demands anything whatsoever. Patriarchy oppressing you Natalia? According to you, they don’t owe you anything.

  16. “”….That should be quoted back at her every time she demands anything whatsoever……””

    This is from textbook “How to recognize liberal”. Many people blaming other people for different things. But only liberal accusing you in the very same thing he/she is doing himself on the very same time.

    Putin never blamed Litvinenko for poisoning he`s tea. Hitler blamed Jews for many things but he never blamed Jews for nazism. Only liberal Antifa beating you and accusing you same time for using violence.

  17. Hmmm. So a man cheating on his partner is just fine. After all, they don’t ‘owe’ them anything.

    I can’t think of a single woman I know who would be fine with that. They might even be a bit insecure about it.

    I refuse to even look at Twitter (thanks Tim for enduring it) but has anyone said to her “what’s good for the goose is good for the gander”?

  18. Just another commie cow who thinks a deal isn’t a deal and tries to walk out of restaurants without paying. probably a shoplifter too

    A thief, pure and simple.

  19. What’s the context of that original tweet? Who are they talking about? I couldn’t find the full context from what I read on twitter.

  20. What’s the context of that original tweet? Who are they talking about?

    As usual with Antonova’s warblings on Twitter, it’s difficult to tell. This is what happens when you have followers who will “like” whatever you write, as opposed to criticise you and correct your grammatical errors like my readers do.

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