Incels: a lot like modern feminists

In the past week or so a new term has entered into the mainstream lexicon: incel, which is an abbreviation of involuntarily celibate. It is the word used to describe angry young men who can’t get laid and then go onto commit acts of violence, often describing their lack of success with women as motivation for their crimes. The term has come to prominence because someone fitting this description drove a van into a bunch of people in Toronto, killing 10.

There is no doubt that the Toronto van driver and others like him display deep-rooted misogyny and hate women, but nevertheless it’s worth trying to understand how and why they became so alienated. However, feminist Twitter is having none of it, believing social ostracism and mental illness is something to be disregarded entirely insofar as men are concerned. As usual, feminist bellwether Natalia Antonova provides a neat example:

Firstly, allow me to mention the irony that a journalist and playwright is seemingly unaware of the term “Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned”.

Secondly, what else is the third-wave feminist movement but a planet-sized temper tantrum that the sexual revolution didn’t deliver as promised in terms of power, prestige – and romantic partners? It sure as hell isn’t about rights, given the movement’s roots in American academia and its proponents overwhelmingly coming from coastal, metropolitan liberal arts circles where women enjoy more rights than at any point in human history. Modern, western feminism is largely about self-entitled, privileged, middle-class women demanding nice things in life they are not prepared to earn, preferring to believe it’s the unreasonableness of men that is preventing them attaining what they so richly deserve.

In terms of dealing with rejection – something all of us must face throughout our lives – feminists are no better than incels. True, they don’t go around murdering people with vans but their effect on society has been equally if not more destructive. And say what you like about deranged, homicidal incels but they at least refrain from giving self-righteous lectures about how virtuous they are when the full extent of the carnage is known. The feminist reaction to incels is that of a self-declared victim group protecting its turf and ensuring they have a monopoly on gender-based suffering; any and all sympathy or understanding for those confused, angry, and ostracised by the opposite sex must go to feminists and nobody else. Either that, or they’re simply upset because, amid all the hysterical screeching and yelling, some men are trying to get a word in edgeways.

Whatever the case, there’s not a whole lot of difference that I can see between lunatic incels and deranged, third-wave feminists.

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47 thoughts on “Incels: a lot like modern feminists

  1. Incels are misogynists because they were taught that acting like girls would make them popular with the ladies. It doesn’t.

  2. Incels are misogynists because they were taught that acting like girls would make them popular with the ladies.

    I’d be willing to bet that a good percentage of incels had overbearing, feminist mothers who tried to rid their sons of any trace of masculinity.

  3. According to Jordan Peterson women’s sexual fantasies feature pirates and other rugged characters. It just won’t be safe to venture out soon with all these girly men renting vans.

  4. @TBT,

    Well, certainly the decision to marry Charles Bronson is entirely devoid of rationality.

  5. Incels and feminists. Seems if we could just find a way to get these two groups of crazy kids together, we could solve a lot of problems.

  6. The Guardian’s response to the “incel” threat was interesting.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/apr/25/raw-hatred-why-incel-movement-targets-terrorises-women

    Vehicle attack linked to obscure misogynist movement? Detailed examination of how this movement embodies a threat to women and civilised values.

    Series of vehicle and other attacks where the perpetrators shout “Alahu Akbar” and tell police they want to establish a Caliphate? No comment. Or maybe they are mentally ill loners.

  7. It occurs to me that both Incels and 3rd wave feminists could well be nature’s way of trying to clear the gene pool of people who, for most of human history, would have been eaten by bears.

    After all most of these people could get laid. Almost everyone can, even me.

    Most women under 30 and men over 30 (assuming they have achieved some material trappings and/or maturity) can get someone to fuck them. And even if not, they have hookers in Canada, right?

    As WTP points out, Incel/Feminazi is the ideal partnership but cunning old mother nature makes sure they are so deluded about what they deserve that it will never happen.

  8. I think the basic cause of the incel phenomenon is threefold. First of all, because everything is so sexualised nowadays it’s much harder for men to have close platonic friendships, meaning that many people now rely on romantic relationships for all their emotional and physical intimacy needs. Secondly, pop culture (including feminist writers and journalists) often seems to treat sex as the summum bonum of human life, such that anybody who doesn’t have lots of sex in lots of ways with lots of different people is seem as missing out, and anybody who has no sex at all is seen as (at best) pitiable, and (quite often) creepy and weird. Thirdly, romance is much more of a free-for-all now than it was in previous generations: whereas previous young men’s parents, the congregants at their church, and so on, would seek to set them up with someone, now they’ve got to find someone on their own, which is going to make things much harder for shy or awkward people. The overall result is that we’ve got a cohort of people who (1) don’t have many or any close personal relationships, (2) are constantly being made to think that they’re failures, and (3) don’t have much in the way of a support network to help them overcome their problems. It’s no wonder they end up feeling bitter and angry, and, whilst I’m not sure what exactly we as a society could do to help them (or even if there’s anything we can realistically do), showing them a little sympathy instead of just contempt is probably a good start.

  9. The Original Mr. X makes very good points, but I would like to add that both third wave feminism and incels are both part of identity politics – an offshoot of Marxism developed at Frankfurt University. The folks behind the ‘theory’ left Germany once the Nazis came to power and most of them ended up at Columbia University in NY.
    Their ‘theory’, critical theory, didn’t take off until the turbulent sixties, mainly because it was so alien to traditional American philosophy, which developed from the Anglo/Scotch tradition – individuals, NOT groups.
    I realize because of America’s large cultural footprint that people think every ‘new’ idea comes from there, but blaming the Americans for every societal blight is an old and ridiculous European habit. Europeans, and specifically the Germans, need to take responsibility for the poison that Marx and Engels produced.

  10. “Europeans, and specifically the Germans, need to take responsibility for the poison that Marx and Engels produced.”

    Would that be because we’re not individuals but bear group responsibility because we’re “part of the same group”?

    QED: The “net-right” are absolutely fine in applying the politics of identity to the out-groups they want to smear.

  11. V good Mr X and more humane than my stuff about bears.

    I think my point about people being unhappy (and celibate) because they refuse to settle for what – sexually or romantically – they are ‘worth’ stands though. Society does unrealistically boost people’s expectations.

  12. Jordan Peterson – 12 Rules:

    “Chaos, the eternal feminine, is also the crushing force of sexual selection. Women are choosy maters (unlike female chimps, their closest animal counterparts). Most men do not meet female human standards.

    It is for this reason that women on dating sites rate 85 percent of men as below average in attractiveness. It is for this reason that we all have twice as many female ancestors as male (imagine that all the women who have ever lived have averaged one child. Now imagine that half the men who have ever lived have fathered two children, if they had any, while the other half fathered none).

    It is Woman as Nature who looks at half of all men and says, “No!” For the men, that’s a direct encounter with chaos, and it occurs with devastating force every time they are turned down for a date.

  13. “…deranged, third-wave feminists…”

    You mean there’s another sort?

  14. @Jean – “poison that Marx and Engels produced”

    May Day is a timely reminder of the legacy of the pure evil and insidious legacy of this pair. Critical theory, more like destruction of everything that is good in the name of justice, politics, law, culture, art, science, morals, tradition, family, gender and everything else that was good that I missed. Oh and not forgetting the destruction of hundreds of millions of people as well.

  15. “angry young men who can’t get laid and then go onto commit acts of violence”

    Should we suppose the logical next step from the left will be the demand that the state provide a safety net for these vulnerable men in the form of compulsory “alternative civilian service” by females? I hear early bolsheviks did something along these lines.

  16. Bloke in Germany – the government in Trier just accepted an eighteen foot statue of Marx from the Chinese! I’ve lived in Germany for 10 years – everything is blamed on the ‘Amis.’ It was Marx who wrote that the Jews owned all of the ‘capital’ in Europe and Engels wrote that Europeans should commit mass murder against the European Jews.
    I could never understand how the Germans, the most educated, cultured society of the time could commit genocide. Having watched television over there they are brain-washed, and dangerous.
    And it isn’t a question of identity politics when one has an actual, real enemy.

  17. Great post by The Original Mr X.

    I would only add the additional point that generations of young men have been flat out lied to about what the true nature of female sexual attraction is – any young man who listened to the feminist driven media over the last 40 years would have concluded that in order to be attractive to the opposite sex you need to be a feminised non-sexual being who ‘respects her as a person’. So when you’ve listened hard, and behaved as you are told to, and the outcome has been the exact opposite of what you were led to believe, there is an understandable reaction of frustration and anger. Which in these interconnected days of instant global communication means misery seeks out misery and together they breed even more misery. And in extreme cases the violent result as in this case.

  18. @Jean

    “””….. the Germans, need to take responsibility for the poison that Marx and Engels produced……”””

    Those two were not Germans.

    “”….I could never understand how the Germans, the most educated, cultured society of the time could commit genocide….””

    Well, lot of people think that they didn’t. Only fact that doubting the official version is a crime and people going to prison for because of speaking or writing, is solid proof that something is very wrong with this story.

  19. This sudden interest in “Incels” will disappear as soon as someone points out that a lot of the devout Muslim men who commit acts of Islamist terror entirely fit the description…

    After all, a lot of them seem to be not-exactly-marriagable types in a largely polygamous culture with an absolute prohibition on out of wedlock sex.

  20. @abacab

    I think that now is the moment when somebody points out that devout Muslim men and Incels are only the consequences.

    And then people will ask, how the hell we got into such mess. How our smart and progressive societies got to the point that we don`t have no jobs, no sex, no security, no homeland….nothing. How all this happened and who did it ?

    And then one ethnic group and religion will face the biggest challenge in their 4000 year old history.

  21. I applaud The original Mr. X’s compassion but still find myself in sympathy with MC’s first comment.

    I am not persuaded that so-called “incels” are a real thing (outside of a very small minority of cases involving serious physical or mental disability). If anything, it sounds like a “mean girls” epithet.

    That the mainstream media might have latched on to a mean girls thing and vigorously propagated it is not surprising. Bunch of cunts, wretched hive of scum and villainy, etc, etc.

  22. @ Jim:

    I would only add the additional point that generations of young men have been flat out lied to about what the true nature of female sexual attraction is – any young man who listened to the feminist driven media over the last 40 years would have concluded that in order to be attractive to the opposite sex you need to be a feminised non-sexual being who ‘respects her as a person’. So when you’ve listened hard, and behaved as you are told to, and the outcome has been the exact opposite of what you were led to believe, there is an understandable reaction of frustration and anger.

    That’s a good point, and I suspect this is also at the root of all the “Where have the good men gone?”-style complaints. Spend 40 years telling men that they should act like feminised weeds, and the nice men, who want to do the right thing, will act like weeds, making themselves boring and unattractive as a result. Meanwhile the jerks don’t care about being good and pro-social, meaning they’ll just ignore the message and consequently seem sexy and attractive, but the same character traits that make them ignore what society’s telling them also make them bad partners in the long term.

  23. @ TOR – “I am not persuaded that so-called “incels” are a real thing”

    Me neither, seems to me to be yet another manufactured, exaggerated and unnecessary concern over sexual activities from the same mob that created multi genders and many more sexualities.

  24. Well, this is all very uncomfortable, many aspects of those definitions describe me to a T (excluding the violence which I totally condemn). Some of them are pretty nasty too (first definition at UD simple says they have ‘horrible personality’ and ‘blatant sexism’, which since I’m not leftist or down with the 3rd wave feminist crap the writer would probably say I am)

    At 37, and shaving never had a serious long term relationship (record is 2 months) I am increasingly resigned to being a lifelong bachelor. Having said that, the older I get I also find myself becoming more embittered and jealous of all my friends who have married and started families, so I can see why some might snap and do these horrible acts (which are still totally unjustifiable and unforgivable)

    Finally, another tip of the hat to Mr. X for his insightful comments.

  25. Expect the term “incel” to be inflated to mean any bloke that hasn’t got his leg over in the last six months.

  26. Andy, thanks for you honesty, I think it goes to show that this “incel” thing is a construct label with no substance other than to subvert society as we know it.

    If it’s any consolation being married and having a family is not all beer and skittles or the only objective in life. What if you had children that were handicapped or had special needs, major health problems, disabled in an accident and fully dependent on you in your elder years, or turned out to be criminals or complete arseholes or say a dragon of a wife that not only cheated and humiliated you but cleaned you out financially, just saying.

    Most people post and talke the nicer side of having a family but not necessarily the potential downside.

  27. Juri – it was the ancient Israelis who noticed the connection between young unmarried men and violence, and they ended polygamy. King David had a ‘harem’ but shortly thereafter the practice was forbidden. Once you go down the route of blaming ‘Jews’ for any problems you perceive your society to have you have officially descended into madness, from whence genocide follows.
    There were fewer than 500,000 Jews living in Germany when the Nazis were voted into power, but every single problem was laid at their feet. To the modern European the Americans fulfill the same role – ‘they’ ruined ‘our’ Eden!
    European’s failure to integrate Islam into Europe’s self grandiose idea of itself is a failure of the EU – everyone is secular. No, people need meaning, and purpose, in life. Your problem is that you can’t differentiate between Jewish Europeans who were integrated into the European mainstream and Jihadis who want to disrupt the entire ‘project’. If you want to think on deeper things all philosophy is basically Plato vs. Aristotle and the Skeptics opposed to both.

  28. As pointed out by others, “incel” was the default position for most men throughout human history.

    We now have the internet which allows them to talk more to each other and for feminists to point at them and jeer.

  29. I am not persuaded that so-called “incels” are a real thing (outside of a very small minority of cases involving serious physical or mental disability).

    Nor am I, their numbers are probably negligible, and almost all will grow out of it.

  30. Me neither, seems to me to be yet another manufactured, exaggerated and unnecessary concern over sexual activities from the same mob that created multi genders and many more sexualities.

    Exactly. Just as feminists seized upon the matter of fat Hollywood producers exploiting desperate actresses to form the MeToo movement and pretend every woman is subject to sexual abuse from patriarchal menfolk, so they have leaped on this incel thing to highlight how oppressed they are.

  31. At 37, and shaving never had a serious long term relationship (record is 2 months) I am increasingly resigned to being a lifelong bachelor.

    I don’t know what the situation is like in Japan, but in any European or Anglo-Saxon country you could find a partner with which to have a family within five minutes flat if that’s what you want. It’s not like it was when you were 25 and the women swanned around like princesses, women around 32-37 would be falling over themselves to get hitched with a single guy of 37 (unless they have *serious* personality problems which have kept them single). Of course, you might not like any of the women in your dating pool but if your priority is finding someone and having a relationship you can overlook pretty much everything except for an obnoxious personality and mental problems. Which rules out a lot of them, admittedly.

    Having said that, the older I get I also find myself becoming more embittered and jealous of all my friends who have married and started families

    Firstly, I wouldn’t be jealous: having families comes with its own set of problems. Secondly, if you want it *that* much, it’s well within your grasp. At this stage, it’s all about priorities. One of the biggest problems affecting women in over 35 is they haven’t got their priorities straight (I’ll blog on this soon). Those that have get what they want in pretty short order.

  32. Andy in Japan – I am in a slightly similar situation in that I have never married, although I also don’t want to. I would like to have children (intimations of mortality I guess) but my aversion to long term relationships is greater than my desire to procreate*.

    Is the fact that you’re in Japan an added difficulty? In London a 37 year old guy who is anything approaching normal should be able to find someone (although that someone is likely to be a bit mental).

    *I don’t know if this makes me a confirmed bachelor or a weirdo…

  33. Tim Newman,

    “Modern, western feminism is largely about self-entitled, privileged, middle-class women demanding nice things in life they are not prepared to earn, preferring to believe it’s the unreasonableness of men that is preventing them attaining what they so richly deserve.”

    And in that regard, they’re a lot like incels.

    I know some men who haven’t had girlfriends since forever and it’s nearly all about them. They don’t work particularly hard, don’t try and better themselves with exercise or grooming, and they spend all their time on hobbies with other incels that means they meet no women, like table top gaming and beer festivals.

    My tip to almost all single men: take dance lessons. There’s tons of clubs out there doing ballroom, salsa and latin that are oversubscribed with women. Dating is a numbers game.

  34. I think that anyone who isn’t ‘on the spectrum’ can really truly understand what its like to try and deal with romantic relationships when you just don’t ‘get’ emotions and are unable to read the social cues that most people take for granted. I would definitely say I was like that in my 20s and it took me years to learn things that most people get naturally, or far earlier than I did. It most definitely can be learned, but you need a bit of intelligence to pull it off – if you don’t have that, I can see you could be stuck in an intensely frustrating loop whereby you fail, you don’t know why, you seek information on the subject, which advises X, you do X, and you still fail, repeat ad nauseam.

    And the people who get it naturally are obviously quite sceptical – Look its easy to get a girlfriend, you just do it! And are completely oblivious that not everyone CAN just ‘do it’ the way they can. It would be just as daft for someone who can run fast to berate someone who can’t – Its easy to run the 100m in 11 seconds, I do it all the time, why can’t you? Are not a real man or something????

  35. Thanks for the replies.

    Bardon- you’re right it isn’t the be all and end all and I’m grateful for all the good things in my life. However when you’re with a groups of friends and you’re the only one not married with kids it is hard to avoid feeling left or inadequate.

    Tim and MC- part of the reason I can to Japan is because of my failings in the west (the only relationships I’ve had have been since coming to Asia, I’ve never gotten beyond 1-nighters or a few dates in the UK). I spent 7 years working in London, doing all the typical things to meet people (bars, clubs, speed dating, dating sites/apps, etc, all to no avail.

    ‘women around 32-37 would be falling over themselves to get hitched with a single guy of 37’ I suspect that women are also judging that if a man is single at my age there must be something wrong with him, best avoided.

    Jim- definitely agree, its not as easy as suggested by Tim if you’re a bit shy/awkward/etc. One realization I’ve come to in the past few years (which also became apparent when I was doing my teacher training) is that I’m terribly bad at reading body language, especially the signals that a women is or isn’t interested.

  36. “I don’t know what the situation is like in Japan, but in any European or Anglo-Saxon country you could find a partner with which to have a family within five minutes flat if that’s what you want. It’s not like it was when you were 25 and the women swanned around like princesses, women around 32-37 would be falling over themselves to get hitched with a single guy of 37 (unless they have *serious* personality problems which have kept them single). Of course, you might not like any of the women in your dating pool but if your priority is finding someone and having a relationship you can overlook pretty much everything except for an obnoxious personality and mental problems. Which rules out a lot of them, admittedly.”

    Your statement above contains a major flaw Tim. If women reach the age of 32-37 without some kind of permanent relationship there is almost certainly something badly wrong with them. Barring extreme circumstances such as just having escaped from some nutters basement etc.

  37. If women reach the age of 32-37 without some kind of permanent relationship there is almost certainly something badly wrong with them.

    I’d not go so far as to say something is badly wrong with them, but there are very good reasons why they are still single which become apparent after about 5-10 minutes. Not all of those reasons are bad per se, but they are reasons nonetheless.

  38. Not all of those reasons are bad per se

    No, but if they’ve reached the age of 30+ and been in the usual multitude of clusterfuck relationships then their ability to pair bond at (for a woman at least), this late stage in the game then an ordinary guys chances of achieving this with her long term are slim-to-none.

    This is the real heart of the damage that feminism has done to women and why women (especially working class and lower middle class women) are the main casualties of feminism, because it actively pushes them into essentially life destroying behaviours such as casual sex which destroy their ability to pair bond and are inevitably destroying civil society itself because of the knock on consequences (single motherhood and alienated fathers and children).

    If you don’t see a field of red flags like a Chinese national day parade then you must be blind.

  39. Andy in Japan,

    “I spent 7 years working in London, doing all the typical things to meet people (bars, clubs, speed dating, dating sites/apps, etc, all to no avail.”

    ” its not as easy as suggested by Tim if you’re a bit shy/awkward/etc.”

    The problems with those methods is that they suit men who have high value in looks and charm, and typically, the women who are out are looking for those men. The effect of clubs and bars is hugely exaggerated through various media. It’s where people meet in movies. Personally speaking though, I never had any luck in years of trying it and I don’t think many people do.

    I think most people meet women through friends and shared interests. Parties, work, college, friends, and hobbies. So, get a hobby, something you at least don’t mind doing where there’s a good mix.

  40. Dance lessons sorted out my best friend from school and separately a close relative of mine. But I don’t know if the effect stops working if you are “going dancing with intent” rather than merely with an openness to new people and experiences in general.

  41. Young men (in fact all young male animals too) need to blow off steam. They’re full of testosterone and energy and simply have to burn off this energy – or it’ll get redirected in unexpected and unpleasant ways. Fighting, sport, sex, gambling, drinking, etc – all those ‘terrible’ things actually serve a purpose. Our feminised society has made being a young man and wanting to do all the things young men want and need to do unecessarily problematic. Imagine being a a young Muslim man. No sex, no booze, religious discipline, no fun at all – that’d screw you up pretty damn quick. And so they blow off with AKs and IEDs.
    The best thing the government could do would be to legalise pot and brothels. The feminists would, of course, have a cow!

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