Freezing eggs won’t help you, ma’am

A reader sends me a link to this article which begins thusly:

Today is my birthday – I’m 36. I’m celebrating, since you ask, with an outing to Richmond Deer Park, followed by champagne and pizza in the garden. I know: so civilised and mature.

This is to let you know she’s a middle class wannabe posho. If only single women in their mid-thirties knew how unoriginal stuff like this is, and how shallow it makes them look, they’d quit doing it in a heartbeat.

Anyway, just over a year ago, heading for 35, I was sitting in a pub with my father in central London…

You just knew it wasn’t going to be in a shopping centre in Wolverhampton, didn’t you?

…and I asked him a favour. With his coolly quantitative analytical skills – he studied physics as a young man – could he please help me decide whether I should freeze my eggs before I turned 35?

And he thought he was going for a quiet pint. Of all the topics to discuss with your dad, this is an odd one indeed. And all because he studied physics in his youth.

I didn’t think too hard about whether the ‘right’ man to do it with would appear. In fact, I have always thought the desire to be a mother must trump romantic uncertainty. If need be, I’d find a male friend (or try to find one) to co-parent. If I really wanted a child and nothing else offered itself I could always go the sperm bank route.

After which you could carve out a career writing articles on how hard it is to raise a child alone, and how the government should do more for people like you.

It turns out that in this respect I’m a bit different from my peers. A report last week found that women are freezing their eggs not because of their careers as has been commonly assumed but to give themselves more time to find a good partner with whom to start a family.

Oh yes, their failure to settle down with a suitable partner in a decade and a half is because they’ve not had quite enough time.

The Yale University study, which analysed the egg freezing motivations of 150 Israeli and American women, found that women “weren’t freezing to advance, they were facing the overarching problem of partnership”.

Well, yes and no. Most will have prioritised their careers such that they’re now too old to find a decent partner. So while it’s true they may not want to advance further, the root cause is their careers took priority at a time when there was an abundance of suitable men.

Thanks to the internet, women may have more romantic and sexual options than ever before, but the quality of options is downright depressing.

Whereas 35 year old women who don’t know what they want and turn to their fathers for advice on egg-freezing is just what every guy dreams of. Every woman I speak to or read on the subject of online dating complains about the quality of men as if they’re the catch of the year. They don’t seem to realise the men they’re meeting on the internet are their peers, counterparts in the same dating pool.

Clearly, many women freezing their eggs think it’s possible that the right man can eventually be found with a few extra years’ searching.

It’s amazing what desperate people will believe, isn’t it?

Have you ever scrolled through the male options on the dating apps Tinder, OkCupid, or Bumble? Try it. It’s not pretty: man after man gurning from a cringingly contrived mirror selfie, big black sunglasses on, too much hair gel, leering or vacant expressions and an incoherent word or two by way of ‘profile’ description.

Because the women on Tinder and OkCupid just exemplify marriage material, don’t they? The duck-faced pouting, the cleavage shots, the list of demands in the profile, the sense of entitlement that accompanies every description, the empty references to travel, food, and “having fun”. And leering expressions, you say? Here’s a photo of the author:

Be still my beating heart.

Often the man is posing, topless, with some kind of animal. (I don’t know why that’s a thing, but it is). There’s very little boyfriend – let alone father – material about.

This woman has been writing about dating and relationships for 20 years, yet here she is, single, asking her dad for advice, and sneering at the men she finds online.

When one does manage to find anyone halfway nice looking and able to hang a sentence together, good luck actually arranging a satisfactory meeting with them.

I imagine they make a beeline for the door the moment they discover you’re a feminist.

My friend Katrina, 37, who happens to have just completed three rounds of egg freezing, is a case in point. Like the women in the study, she froze her eggs not for the purposes of her (extremely successful) career but in the hopes of finding a partner.

In her attempt to do so, she has doggedly trawled a number of dating sites and apps, and tried speed dating events for hipsters and posh people. She’ll often be chatting with several men at once. But when it comes to actually meeting up, they simply vanish into thin air – or, like one mysteriously-occupied “entrepreneur”, keep ignoring the fact that she has a demanding day job, and suggesting impromptu coffees at one in the afternoon instead of the evening drinks she offered.

Firstly, men don’t care she has a demanding day job: after all, that is likely what landed her in this position in the first place. If she is still prioritising her work, chances are she’s not going to make a very good partner. Secondly, a quick coffee at 1pm is much better for a first date than evening drinks. There is no pressure, no expense, you’re in a public place so it’s quite safe, and if you don’t like one another you can leave easily. It sounds as though this Katrina expects to be romanticised over expensive cocktails she won’t be paying for, and is unwilling to compromise. Little wonder she’s single.

It’s all very frustrating and leads me to think that women who want to be mothers should go a non-traditional route, be that sperm bank or something else, rather than waiting around for a Mr Right that may well never appear.

Notice it never seems to occur to these women that they might be the problem? What if Mr Right can’t do evening drinks but only a quick coffee during the day? Oh well too bad, better go freeze my eggs.

Some posit that the mismatch between successful women in their 30s and their male counterparts comes down to women being now the more educated sex. Certainly, my single friends and I all feel that as the quantity of options facing women in their 30s has soared, the quality of the options has dropped off a cliff.

There’s that complaint about quality again, as if Maria Sharapova is writing this column rather than some haggard old feminist. And I’ve written before about how women are so self-absorbed they refuse to date men they believe are intellectually inferior to them. I feel sorry for some single women, but not those who treat men with such utter disdain as the author and her friends seemingly do.

Education may be partly to do with it. But perhaps it’s just that women – trained from an early age to be self-aware, emotionally astute and good at multi-tasking – reach a peak of all-pistons-firing personhood in their 30s and 40s that men simply can’t match.

You really believe that? That you’re so brilliant men simply can’t match you? Or could it be you’re not very nice, you’d make a lousy partner, and men simply aren’t interested?

Whatever the underlying cause, as long as egg freezing brings women relief from stress I’m all for it.

Alas, freezing eggs is so far removed from a solution to your problems it’s a category error, akin to Googling for misplaced car keys. Hell’s bells, feminism has wrought some damage, hasn’t it?

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36 thoughts on “Freezing eggs won’t help you, ma’am

  1. I’m not surprised. From experience, all many single woman in their 30-40s want is a man to father their children. If they already have children, they want him to pay for their upkeep.

    What he is like, or what he wants from life, is pretty irrelevant.

    I never wanted children, so was generally considered a monster by my female friends (except those who choose not to have children).

  2. There’s a woman who shouldn’t bother freezing her eggs but choose a cat instead. As for writing about dating, well, given her implied track record it seems that she’s the last person to take ‘advice’ from in the courts of human affection.

  3. I’m back in Australia trolling Tinder – crikey. Girls in their 20s commonly post pornographic pictures of themselves to attract superspunks for a night of excitement. The photos make me wonder, what would her father think if he saw her showing that to the whole world? And, how can such a woman ever hope to find a husband? Then I see all the much more conservative women aged 35+ who are ‘sick of games’ and want to meet a ‘genuine man’, and I see that they do not have much hope at all if they keep up that hobby for too long.
    I believe that any modern man, if shown secret camera footage of his potential fiance’s entire sexual history, would drop the ring, run to the toilet and vomit.

  4. “If only single women in their mid-thirties knew how unoriginal stuff like this is, and how shallow it makes them look, they’d quit doing it in a heartbeat.”

    Which act in itself confirms their shallowness. Who gives a flying fuck how things look to others?

  5. Which act in itself confirms their shallowness.

    The emphasis on mundane but status-signalling activities. You see a lot of this on Instagram, too. No problem with the activities themselves, but if you’re going to use them for an introduction you can expect to be deemed shallow.

    Who gives a flying fuck how things look to others?

    If you’re going to write a column in a national newspaper, it’s probably best to consider how you come across to others.

  6. I believe that any modern man, if shown secret camera footage of his potential fiance’s entire sexual history, would drop the ring, run to the toilet and vomit.

    The clever ones shut the fuck up about it. The dimmer ones splurge all the details and either demand the new guy accepts everything uncritically, or insists that whatever happened in the past has no bearing on her character or suitability as a partner going forward.

  7. True Tim but most people don’t write columns. And it is still shallow.

    Agreed there is a difference to being who you are and being an oddball nutter ( not too good relationship -wise) but living life trying to impression-manage all the time is as shallow as it gets short of psychopathology.

    And any man dumb enough to think about taking up with the baggage would have to be mega-dumb not to envision the likely future. Stuck with a mouthy womiccumalobus bat who just loves expressing her arseholic left-sick opinions. Sex on an ever-declining scale once she is up the duff. Having to watch her indoctrinate your kid with womi bullshit and also knowing that if you raise even a tiny squeak of protest or complaint then she will divorce you and take you to the cleaners. As well as keep your child and do her best to poison said child against you.

    No thanks.

  8. The problem is hypergamy. Women in general want a man they can look up to, metaphorically at least.
    Teach women that they’re the bees knees and they then run into problems finding a mate.
    If the only women taught this were the ones with actual ability it’d be OK- there are enough high status blokes around for them. But vastly too many are lied to and believe the lies.

  9. Busy, busy, busy with high-flying career – can’t manage meeting for coffee at 1pm.

    Presumably egg harvesting can take place over drinks in the evening and if any of those luckless eggs should turn into a child, it will probably have to wait for a “window” to receive some mothering, poor mite.

    Incidentally, does she relate what advice her father gave her?

  10. Here’s the thing. She complains about how all male profiles look the same. She should see the female profiles. All of them “want to travel”, reference their love of g&ts and brunch. Then you meet them and the all have the same copycat boilerplate leftie views, low paid but high credentialed PR, marketing or charity job (and still expect you to respect them and be willing to let them focus on their “career”). And then they complain that men just judge them about how they look. To which I respond “well if there was anything else available to differentiate you from all the others…”.

  11. Wow. She sounds a keeper….. errr….. wait a moment. She wants the moon on a stick.

    Nobody, but nobody, is going to be good enough for her. Except 96 cats.

  12. (m)any single woman in their 30-40s want is a man to father their children. If they already have children, they want him to pay for their upkeep.

    Or, the old fashioned, non politically correct term for that is “Meal Ticket for Life” without any corresponding obligation for support (emotional, financial and/or housekeeping) from the womyn.

    Man up, suckers. You know it makes (no) sense.

  13. “What if Mr Right can’t do evening drinks but only a quick coffee during the day?“

    I suspect that particular Mr Right has to be home for the wife & kids in the evening. Not that he’ll mention them to the girls he chats up on Tinder.

  14. Tangentially related, I stumbled across a Mumsnet thread the other day which ran like this:

    “My partner of six years left me last year, we have a two year old daughter together. I also have an eleven year old boy from a previous relationship, but his father is no longer in the picture. When my [most recent] partner first arrived, he was a great step-father to my first child. But since he left, he has only wanted contact with his biological child, not his step-child. Now he wants to take his daughter on holiday, but not his step-son. I’m furious that he isn’t treating them equally.”

    To which even the righteous of Mumsnet replied: “well, what did you expect?”.

  15. Incidentally, does she relate what advice her father gave her?

    No she doesn’t, and I wish she had. She ends the section saying, after he did some research for her, that she decided not to freeze her eggs. At the end of the article, however, she’s decided she will.

  16. All of them “want to travel”, reference their love of g&ts and brunch. Then you meet them and the all have the same copycat boilerplate leftie views, low paid but high credentialed PR, marketing or charity job (and still expect you to respect them and be willing to let them focus on their “career”).

    Nail on head sir, nail on head. It’s almost as if they’re written by a piece of software.

  17. I suspect that particular Mr Right has to be home for the wife & kids in the evening.

    That is almost certainly the case if he’s on Tinder, yes!

  18. Is she 36 in Hollywood years or dog years?

    Sorry to breach your community guidelines Tim, you wanting to go all fluffy HR an’ all, but seriously?
    “I write for peanuts about relationships, in the newspapers, i.e. my relationships”
    Even if she was nubile any sane bloke would be getting out of Dodge hot foot.

  19. Tangentially related, I stumbled across a Mumsnet thread the other day which ran like this:

    Oh Lordy. Yeah, Mumsnet is full of those.

  20. Sorry to breach your community guidelines Tim

    I have guidelines?

    This isn’t David Thompson’s place with its fancy dress code and coasters!

  21. While Andrew M is almost certainly correct that the bloke has a wife already, she still might want to meditate on what it says about her that she can’t be arsed to take a late lunch to meet someone.

    As I said in an earlier thread, advertising that you will always put yourself first is not a winning strategy in this game. Be pleasant. Be accommodating. And at the risk of pointing out the blindingly obvious, remember, femininity works.

  22. This isn’t David Thompson’s place with its fancy dress code and coasters!

    [Cracks knuckles, eyes henchlesbians]

  23. When dating in my twenties and thirties, the woman was always the one that was too busy or had to “check my calendar.” Ugh. Thank god those days are over.

  24. And she writes about relationships? Ha ha ha ha! Holy lord. The comments there are quite negative, but she should really start listening to them. They’re the harsh truth.

  25. I’ve just checked the comments. I liked this one:

    Looking for father material on Tinder?! That’s the modern equivalent of looking for mother material on the cards you used to see in phone boxes.

  26. Her sort are so common these days. Bet she looked down on her friends who married and had kids in late 20s as unambitious losers

  27. This isn’t David Thompson’s place with its fancy dress code and coasters!

    No refunds. Credit note only.

  28. Sweet jesus, they all look the same don’t they?

    About as homely and boring as toast, yet somehow can’t get a dude. Wonder why in the world?

    This one is identical to the other plain frau that you posted, who was claiming men were intimidated by her big brain.

    What’s funny is I have plenty of trades-dude friends. Ones this plain jane would look down on. To a one, they all have better looking, nicer wives than what she’d offer.

    What’s the purpose of saving the eggs? Where do they go? A surrogate? If she isn’t there now, she’s soon to hit her sell-by date.

  29. perhaps it’s just that women – trained from an early age to be self-aware, emotionally astute and good at multi-tasking

    Genuine lol. No male should go within 200m of her. The delusion and ideology are miles deep.

  30. > She’ll often be chatting with several men at once. But when it comes to actually meeting up, they simply vanish into thin air

    This should tell her something important, namely that — for whatever reason (or combination of reasons) — she is not attractive to men.

    It’s pretty hard to find any sort of man for anything, let alone fathering your babies, when you’re not attractive to men.

  31. As one of the main differences between the sexes, men are mostly led into relationships by lust. Twenty-something men looking at twenty-something women see desirable sexual partners or . . . not.

    A man looking at a woman over thirty-five is never going to see that same sleek and smooth beauty he can see in someone closer to girlhood. Thus, a man looking at women over thirty-five is never going to feel the same sexual passion and urgency to capture as he will feel looking at a twenty-year-old.

    Lacking that lusty fire, a man is going to be much less willing to give up his singlehood freedoms than he would be otherwise. Women either don’t see this, or work very hard to ignore it, but it’s a fact of physical life.

    Very few men get sexually aroused by a woman’s “great career” or political wokeness. Such qualities will not substitute for simple lust. Lacking the winning of a desirable sexual conquest, marriage is, to men, of dubious benefit. If you’re sex-driven, why bother marrying when all of the thirty-something women will go on tryout sleepovers at the drop of a hat?

    (Yes, I know that some men are driven by the need for co-equal companionship and mutual respect. There are nine of them, and they’re all gay.)

  32. Very few men get sexually aroused by a woman’s “great career” or political wokeness.

    I don’t remember where I read it first – probably Roissy or Heartiste – but what women put in their dating profiles is what they want from a man. They’re too self-centered to get past the notion that what they want from
    a partner isn’t universal to everybody.

  33. “Attractive to men”
    And it is not just looks. It is attitude.
    I have long believed that when it comes to mating for life it is the woman who decides, after first selecting.
    It is she who uses conscious and instinctive wiles, skills, whatever to get her man. And one of those skills is to make the man believe that he is in control, and it is all his idea.
    And superficial appearance does not matter much. Most men will settle down with someone who looks like a young version of his mum. And most mums are not great beauties.
    What I am getting at is that this woman’s facial appearance, (and body, not shown in photograph), other than the fact that it betrays her attitude, does not matter.
    And her problem is attitude.

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