From whence the anger?

Today somebody actually replied to my question on Twitter as to whether the unpaid work done by men gets counted when declaring that women are suffering under the crippling burden of housework, which I wrote about here. Sadly, it wasn’t from the study’s author but a deranged feminist:

Can you imagine being in a relationship with such a person? I can’t, and I think it would be a safe bet that this woman has never had a stable, functioning relationship in her life. I post this because having spent a year or so exploring modern feminism, or third-wave feminism as it’s often called, I have reached the conclusion that much of it is driven by women whose personalities are too poisonous for them to build a relationship with a man of their choosing. That’s not to say all third-wave feminists are single, but a lot of them seem to despise their partners (e.g. Jessica Valenti) or show signs (e.g. Laurie Penny, and the woman in the tweet above) of being such unpleasant characters that no sane man would want anything to do with them.

Which leaves us with an interesting question. Is their obnoxious personality a result of their failing to find a decent partner, or is their failing to find a decent partner a result of their obnoxious personality? My guess is it starts with the latter, then forms a vicious circle.

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52 thoughts on “From whence the anger?

  1. There’s your answer then – men’s unpaid work absolutely does not count. In fact, it counts so little that your new friend there doesn’t even recognise its existence.

    That’s you told then! :p

  2. Answer: Neither.

    Its due to them being caught up in this feminism ideology mindset which in fifty odd years has indoctrinated them into this all men are useless, cant be trusted and cant rise to the challenges of sexual equality view. A movement that has steered them away from their natural role and loving instincts, surrendering her love for a man and receiving the love, gratitude and respect of him and his family which is the bedrock of our survival. Show me a functional family and I will show you a fulfilled lady irrespective of her looks, body or sexual attractiveness. Show me a feminist and I will show the opposite.

  3. Mr Tim, if you clear out gutters can you please find time to come and do mine, given as you have 364 other days per annum free? Thanks in advance.

    In other news: Hedy Lamarr was attractive and talented, but I note the tweet was from HedyLamar8, which as eni fule kno is modern shorthand for ‘hate’

    So this personoid hates Hedy? Bitch!

  4. By the standards of feminism men should count the time it takes to travel to and from work as ‘working time’.

  5. I’ve lived my life surrounded by strong and seemingly happy women, wife, mother, sisters and aunts. None of them seemed angry or unfulfilled and I seemed to have passed through life without attracting the attention of shrieking harpies, something I intend to continue. Do none of these women have any roll models in their family or social circle that they can emulate? or are they just angry at their inability to function like the rest of us?

  6. Hedy Lamarr came up with one of the first devices that, after a couple more generations of tinkering, evolved into the cell phone!

  7. /pedantry

    I had a feeling I might have messed that up and dearieme would be along to correct me!

    I’m not the first to notice that your English often surpasses those of the native Brits you interact with. I blame state education.

  8. Their obnoxious personality stems from a society that has to some extent given them absolute moral authority based solely on their status as women. This derives somewhat from the pacification of our society. Obnoxious behavior is tolerated on many fronts because there is no physical push back. Women are in the most powerful position in such an environment because beta males will kowtow to such women for sex. Even alpha males will fall in line, using the social power of such a situation to silence other men while they use their resulting rise in the power heirarchy to sexually abuse women, as seen in the numerous recently exposed sex scandals. Absolute power corrupts.

  9. WTP, one theory I’ve read is that men simply don’t know how to deal with women in the workforce. It’s only been two generations for the most part that mixed workforces have existed and the structures simply don’t work. The rise of the HR industry would almost certainly correlate with the % of women in the workforce.

  10. one theory I’ve read is that men simply don’t know how to deal with women in the workforce

    Not sure how true that is. But I am only basing that thought on my own experience. I have been out of the office environment for nearly a decade now so things may have changed but when I was, I never had a problem with any women I worked with that came about because of their sex.

    I work in da meedja so have aways worked in offices with a lot of women and have had a few female bosses too. Never a problem. When I had staff to manage the two people I had to get rid of were both women, but the reasons were not related to their sex. Actually the problem was in both cases that they talked a good game at interview but weren’t good enough, which you’d expect to be a male thing! OK, one turned out to be crazy but anyway…

    What I did notice is that women in the workplace are utterly, utterly vile to each other. One woman I worked with – perfectly pleasant in other ways – turned on the woman who was her best friend in the office after that friend was promoted ahead of her. This led to literally years of snideness and attempts to undermine her former bestie.

    A young woman who worked for me once complained almost in tears about the peer pressure and bitchiness regarding how women in the office dressed. Apparently there was an undercurrent of spiteful competitiveness and, you guessed it, bitching about clothes.

    Misogynist: a man who hates women as much as women hate one another.

  11. “What I did notice is that women in the workplace are utterly, utterly vile to each other.

    I’ve seen this time and again, and still have no idea how to deal with it! This actually cause a company I invested in to completely collapse, the two female partners simply fell out in a nuclear way and tore the company down to spite each other.

  12. I commend “whencesoever”: its archaic quality suits a discussion of these modern witches.

  13. What I did notice is that women in the workplace are utterly, utterly vile to each other

    You occasionally meet a man who doesn’t like working for a woman. You rarely meet a woman who doesn’t like working for a man. You frequently meet a woman who doesn’t like working for a woman.

  14. Utterly and entirely unrelated.

    Yes, we’ve discussed this at your place. I can understand feminists being pro-abortion, what I can’t understand is the callousness with which they treat the subject which sometimes extends even to celebrating abortions. It’s seriously fucked up.

  15. ” You frequently meet a woman who doesn’t like working for a woman.”

    I saw a female boss systematically bully (to the point of quitting) – and in some cases even fire – every single strong women in her charge if they didn’t exactly jump into line with her ridiculous and often impossible to follow management decisions.

    One of them is working for me now.

  16. They’re spoilt entitled children. Generally the progeny of the middle class who bluff achievement and think they deserve a lot more than they’re getting. They want something for nothing “I don’t have to be nice. I don’t have to work for capitalists. I don’t see why I should be a housewife”. Well, great, live outside the system. But don’t expect anything. Because you’re not giving anything.

    I know high achieving women, and young women making a start, and they don’t want to be known as feminists.

  17. I’m not the first to notice that your English often surpasses those of the native Brits you interact with.

    You make me feel a bit of a fraud by saying that my English often surpasses those that of native Brits.

    Although I’m certainly krauter than BiG, I’m pretty native and the handle has more to do with being a bull in a china shop in a mildish way.

  18. I know high achieving women, and young women making a start, and they don’t want to be known as feminists.

    I know a smart, capable, and well-educated professional woman who, when I met her, considered herself sympathetic to feminist causes. The thing is, she hails from Turkey where women’s rights are a rather more serious issue than in New York. I’ve spent the past year or so showing her what western, third-wave feminism looks like and now she often remarks on the yawning chasm between what passes for “oppressed” or “empowered” women in western cities and the women’s rights campaigners back in her home country.

  19. You make me feel a bit of a fraud by saying that my English often surpasses those that of native Brits.

    Ahahahaha!

    Although I’m certainly krauter than BiG

    One either is or is not a kraut: there are no gradations of krautery!

  20. In most relationships there will be an imbalance between who does what. The difference is that many women will moan about this whereas most men will just get on with it.

  21. It’s seriously fucked up.

    Publicly cultivating callousness and a kind of competitively sadistic glee doesn’t strike me as a good mate-finding strategy, or a road to contentment and emotional stability, especially as time passes. And displays of that kind are by no means uncommon at Feminist Charisma School. It’s pretty much a signature, an in-group credential.

    As you suggest, there’s probably a feedback loop, in which the ideology attracts a high concentration of obnoxious women, more than chance alone would allow, in part because it offers excuses and opportunities for obnoxious behaviour, and offers flattering explanations for any of the usual consequences of such behaviour – say, romantic failures, and a general tendency to repel people who aren’t similarly obnoxious.

  22. Re. the abortion thing – I tend to bring up the idea that a doctor in the US could one minute be ripping a perfectly healthy 24+ week foetus out of a uterus in pieces on the mother’s say-so, and the next minute be performing in-utero surgery or an emergency C-section on a 22 week old foetus.

    Someone told me that these two cases are completely different.

    But personally I can’t see why the mother’s whim represents such a chasm of difference that foetus A has no personhood and no right to life, whereas foetus B has such a strong right to life that hundreds of thousands of pounds of medical care will be lavished on it.

  23. there are no gradations of krautery!

    The almost 6M Kraüter who voted AfD mightn’t entirely agree and I bet you too could recognise some of the Unkraut if you tried!

  24. “What I did notice is that women in the workplace are utterly, utterly vile to each other”

    Yes, when you have a completely toxic feud that poisons the entire workplace, 10% of the time it will be between a man and a woman, 90% of the time it will be between two women. When men hate each other’s guts, they will avoid each other as far as possible, but with women it’s “Only one queen in the hive! Knives out and anything goes!

  25. “Only one queen in the hive! Knives out and anything goes!”

    On average, men can keep the personal and professional separate. Avoidance of each other is an option where possible, whereas I’ve seen women in conflict actively seek each other out and provoke each other.

  26. I suspect the ability of men to avoid one another comes from the times (i.e. most of history) when engaging with an enemy could easily result in serious injury or death. Better to just avoid them altogether. Women, on the other hand, probably never worried about losing an arm, leg, or life by engaging with their enemies.

  27. “I suspect the ability of men to avoid one another comes from the times (i.e. most of history) when engaging with an enemy could easily result in serious injury or death. Better to just avoid them altogether. Women, on the other hand, probably never worried about losing an arm, leg, or life by engaging with their enemies.”

    Exactly. A serious conflict between men can leave both severely injured or dead. Women are insulated from this reality.

  28. “having spent a year or so exploring modern feminism, or third-wave feminism as it’s often called, I have reached the conclusion that much of it is driven by women whose personalities are too poisonous for them to build a relationship with a man of their choosing.”

    Auberon Waugh used to say that feminism was essentially a Trade Union or pressure group for ugly women. Whereas attractive women could advance themselves by trading on their good looks and charm, those without those characteristics realised (some time around the 1960s) that some form of collective action was required. The traditional goals had to be openly rejected, successful marriageable women attacked as “scabs”, and solidarity with other ugly women provided mutual psychological support and a mass-movement for social change. It’s no different from Age Concern, Scope, or Mencap; society must change because it doesn’t suit a particular disadvantaged minority.

  29. Auberon Waugh used to say that feminism was essentially a Trade Union or pressure group for ugly women.

    One thing I’ve noticed is that no matter how ugly a woman is, she’ll always find herself a partner *if* her personality is pleasant. At the very least, a decent personality can go a *very* long way in getting a man to overlook physical imperfections. On the flip side, even nice-looking women struggle if their personality stinks.

  30. David Moore:
    “one theory I’ve read is that men simply don’t know how to deal with women in the workforce. It’s only been two generations for the most part that mixed workforces have existed and the structures simply don’t work. ”

    As difficult it is for men, I think women have had a much harder time of it but such was their choice/demand. I find it amusing if you go back 40 years and read about why encouraging women in the workplace might be a bad idea, the predictions and such, how many of those predictions have come true. Especially in regard to harassment and such. With a vengeance. And yet at that time those making such predictions were dismissed as retro-conservative-unthinking-morons. Everyone would be “adults” The Narrative insisted.

    And don’t get me started on HR departments and what they have become as women gravitate in that direction.

    MC:
    A bit confused as you say you never had a problem working with women because of their sex yet you go on to state various problems with conflicts and such. Perhaps you personally had no personal problems, I suppose, but seems like it’s not working out too well for others in your milieu.

    In regard to women in the workplace in general, I find it very useful to have at least one woman (and no more than three) in an engineering design meeting. The mere presence keeps certain aspects of male hostility constrained such that we don’t go into infinite dick measuring. Not that such can’t be fun amongst friendlies per se. But get one dick in a dick measuring contest and you might as well be a bunch of girls. I cautiously mentioned this once amongst a couple of alpha-leaning male co-workers, with no women present to pander to, and was surprised not just at the agreement but the enthusiasm of such. I have also found women to be either very good to work for or very bad. There is very little middle ground with women in management/leadership positions. Just my experience.

  31. “I know high achieving women, and young women making a start, and they don’t want to be known as feminists.”

    Such as my happily married daughter, 31, who is a City lawyer. She often says that women have got equal pay, so feminism is redundant.

  32. On the flip side, even nice-looking women struggle if their personality stinks.

    Indeed. Hence the perhaps uncharitabe presumption that unattached attractive female 30+-ers must have some gaping personality flaw.

  33. Pogonip: Hedy Lamarr was the co-inventor of something called frequency-hopping. It was used during WWII in the audio band for a scrambler on the transatlantic line between FDR and WSC. Then it was used for military radio systems before wi-fi, and then for an early version of wi-fi no longer used. I think it’s still used for (some versions of) Bluetooth.

  34. “I suspect the ability of men to avoid one another comes from the times (i.e. most of history) when engaging with an enemy could easily result in serious injury or death. Better to just avoid them altogether. Women, on the other hand, probably never worried about losing an arm, leg, or life by engaging with their enemies.”

    I’m glad I’m not the only person to have come to this conclusion – I was beginning to think maybe I was a bit bonkers for thinking it.

  35. Interesting to hear everyone’s take on women colleagues. When a 30-something, one of my mentors, a senior oil industry engineer, advised me to always include at least one woman on the team. Different perspective aside, they have an uncanny instinct to spot a wrong ’un. Gullible nerk that I am, his advice has served me well.

  36. “Although I’m certainly krauter than BiG”

    Rising to the bait, I’d respectfully suggest that those that asked for it, and had to pass a variety of tests and jump through various hoops to get it, are krautier than those who had it thrust upon them.

    Merely my point-scoring two eurocents in an irresolvable (unresolvable, nonresolvable?) debate that has raged for as long as the concept of citizenship has existed!

  37. “Kraüter”

    Is that how they pronounce it in Meissen dialect? Or are you just not Kraut enough?

  38. “One either is or is not a kraut: there are no gradations of krautery!” Surely one can be half kraut? We’ve just been watching Howards End: my deah, it’s positively littered with half-krauts.

  39. One of the things that feminists will not acknowledge is that women are a net drain on society when it comes to the amount of tax paid and the benefits they draw from that society.

    This New Zealand study discusses the amount of tax paid by men and women, benefits received and the overall costs associated with the two sexes.

    https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2375926

    If nothing else, look at the graphs In Appendix 2 onwards (page 46 onwards)

    Peace, ladies I know that any woman reading this earns Millions, if not billions and that study does not reflect the millions in tax you contribute but that is yet another of the thousands of NAWALT excuses I have heard. The above report shows that, at least in NZ, and most likely in the rest of the western world, that women have it much better than males.

  40. BiG – to (mis)quote the bard – malvolio in Twelfth Night:

    “Some are born Kraut, some achieve Krautness and some have Krautness thrust upon them”.

    Ahem!

    >};o)

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